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Power windows 41-48 Ford
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416Ford
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 11:51 am    Post subject: Power windows 41-48 Ford Reply with quote

Let me start off by saying thanks to phat rat.
What I did can be done on a lot of Fords. Just not sure what years and what may need to change.

What you need.
Power window motor
(Left hand Hollander 617-174L, Dorman 742-250)
(Right hand Hollander 617-205, Dorman 742-251)
Threaded rod (10-32)
Nuts (10-32)



I was told that I could install power windows in my 46 by just adding a power window motor to my original regulators. I was told that Ford used the same gear for many years and this is what phat rat had in his car.
I ordered up a window motor for a 81 ford and went through the set-up just for find out that the motor was too big. He did tell me that he used the SMALL motor. Now I know why….
Here are the steps I used on the SMALL motor.
I purchased a power window motor for a 69 Torino from NAPA.
Remove or in my case grade the spare window regulator.

Remove the crank shaft and the pocket on the back side of the regulator that hold the shaft.


Grind the excess off to make look like a pro did the work not a hack. Smile There is plenty of room for that later.

Set the motor on the back side of the regulator with the gears matched up and mark the two holes. The motor should stand upright in the car or 90* to the door mount.
(The one hole will be close to the factory nut, try and give yourself as much room possible for about a 3/16” hole)

Center punch the two locations and drill the holes.

I purchased a piece of threaded rod 10-32 and about a dozen nuts to help me figure this out and to have in the garage for stock.

The motor needs to be raised up off of the regulator so I cut two piece of threaded rod at about 4” and screw them into the motor mounting holes. Installed one nut on each rod and checked to make sure the holes were in the correct spot for the motor to slide down into position. Adjust hole location if needed.

I then cut two pieces of ½” square ground them as needed to fit over the two hole so I could drill them or in my case grind out a slot for the threaded rod to pass through. I then installed the motor and rods again, tighten them down and check for clearance. If everything is good, weld them on.

Install the motor and flip the assembly over to add the third mount. I installed put a 1/2” square on mine, flush to the bottom of the regulator face. Welded it on, marked my hole and removed the motor. Once the motor was removed I welded the back side and drilled the clearance hole.

Since there is no way to get at the holes without drilling holes in the door and fighting to hold the motor in place while installing it, I opted studs and nut to mount the motor.

The three holes that have the studs will need the studs removed and drilled out for clearance. I also counter sunk the three holes on the back of the regulator for a better weld.

Install studs and a nut through the motor and into the holes so the studs are about flush with the back of the regulator and weld them in place. Remove the nuts, trim the rods long enough to install a lock nut or a double nut set up. Whatever your preference is. I will be using a lock nut and Loctite.

That’s it.
Now re-install them and run your wiring.
















Hope this help someone else also.

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phat rat
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hey you did new motors, I got mine from the boneyard. There are a lot of different FMCO cars that use the small motors. My switches came from the rear doors of a 4 dr Taurus
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416Ford
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Did you use five or six prong? Looking for the harness wire tonight.
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phat rat
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Off the top of my head after 19 years I have no idea. I'll have to look at spare switches and motors
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idrivejunk
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 5:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice write-up and pics. The 41 I worked on last year's owner wanted crank-ups and that was arguably more trouble than converting to power. I found the mess of different channels and regulators and the quality of the available stuff to be alarming. Thought to myself that those vehicles cry out for a cable type regulator conversion. Had a tough time with the windows on that truck, using what I had. But the thing had hidden hinges, shaved handles and power latches. Thanks for showing us the light, it looks fairly simple to modify whats there if you have a good regulator.
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cool! I'll remember this if I decide to do power windows again.
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416Ford
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

idrivejunk wrote:
Nice write-up and pics
Thought to myself that those vehicles cry out for a cable type regulator conversion.


Thanks and I looked at that option also. This is flat glass so I grabbed a motor and regulator out of a back door on a Cherokee. The issue with that was the space to keep the cable in it shape and fabricating mount for everything in the middle of the door where everything is open from the factory.

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enjenjo
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ford Motors work in other makes too. The windows in the Marlin have Lincoln motors on them We did a 63 GMC truck with GM motors. The strangest one was a 40 Chevy four door. Rear power window regulators from an AMC Concord rear doors fit the 41 Chevy front doors by drilling two holes, and changing the angle of the lift arm.
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phat rat
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PostPosted: Tue, Mar 17 2015, 7:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The thing about the cable type is the cables do break or a roller could freeze up. My car is also hidden hinges with shaved handles. But I don't have power latches I use a remote to roll the window down and reach in for the inside handle to open the door. So there's no hidden button for someone to find and one less electrical component to fail
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416Ford
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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 18 2015, 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Any way of knowing if the 95 Roadmaster switch is for a reverse polarity or not?
Or doesn't if matter...
Looking for a small 4 door switch that I can get from a bone yard with the plug.



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PostPosted: Wed, Mar 18 2015, 9:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is a reverse polarity switch. Should work fine. Google Part # 12354968 for the terminals.
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416Ford
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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 11:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Now I feel like an idiot.
I have the switch, have the regulators done and found the pink hot wire form the fuse box. Now all I have to do is wire it..........Now I am in over my head.
I wired my whole car but I can't figure out power windows.
I read about relays, and all I get is more confused with each article telling me a different way of how to do it.
Could someone please draw up or show me a schematic to wire this up. Not sure on witch relays to use either.
I only have two wires going into the doors and I am not installing the switches on the doors, only in the center console..... Thanks

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 12:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Without taking my door apart I can't tell you which wire goes where. But if my memory serves me correctly Ford switches are not reverse polarity like GM is. I did look at an extra switch I have (Ford) and it has 5 wires coming of it and it's a rear door switch.
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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 1:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The other thing that is causing a problem is the remote activated down. Motor wires need to be grounded while at rest.
Jack, the switch is not the main problem for me. it's the motors being reverse polarity and the remote.
I will wire the rear windows next year.

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

You can find a bunch of diagrams here

https://www.google.com/search?q=gm+power+window+switch+wiring+diagram&a mp;espv=2&biw=1280&bih=899&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=un iv&sa=X&ei=tGgMVfKRK4mXgwTq_YIg&ved=0CB0QsAQ#imgdii=_

Use the one that matches your switches.

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416Ford
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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 2:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That is were the confusion all started Frank. Smile It's not just the switch but the remote to lower the window.
My doors are like Jack's with no exterior handle and we need to reach in to open the door.

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Dave, I don't have time right now but tomorrow I'll look through my build file for the instructions on hooking up the remote system I have in my car. I know it's a different company than yours though because mine is a Balls remote and they went out of business years ago. As I recall Ford motors work different than GM. It seems to me that they are not reverse polarity. I have 2 relays on mine for the remote system. One relay is up the other is down. To avoid so many wires going through the door jam my relays are in the door.
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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have the window regulators in now Jack and they are reverse polarity. grounding the motors does not help. I can get the window to go up and down with the remote now if I hook up one wire to the shell of the door and the other to the power wire I used for the popper before. And if I swap them around I can get the window to come down.
I would appreciate you looking. I have two big trees to cut up on Saturday so I will not be working on the car.

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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's the schematic for my windows. If it's to small for you to read pm me your email and I'll send them.


Balls PW #2 001 (640x465).jpg
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PostPosted: Fri, Mar 20 2015, 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

this will do it http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-DIRECTED-DEI-535T-CAR-POWER-WINDOW-AUTOMATI ON-MODULE-ROLL-UP-DOWN-4-ALARM-/111373967127?_trksid=p2054897.l4275
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